MESSAGE
| DATE | 2023-05-14 |
| FROM | Ruben Safir
|
| SUBJECT | Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] (fwd) Re: Human & ape evolution
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Newsgroups: sci.bio.paleontology
Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2023 05:22:37 -0700 (PDT)
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Subject: Re: Human & ape evolution
From: "oot...-at-hot.ee"
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Xref: panix sci.bio.paleontology:77223
On Monday, 17 April 2023 at 13:58:23 UTC+3, marc verhaegen wrote:
> 4 frequent paleo-anthropological prejudices, with 0 evidence:=20
> Many PAs still *assume* that human ancestors=20
> 1) became bipedal when we left the trees for the gound??=20
> 2) came Out-of-Africa (OoA)??=20
> 3) were savanna-dwellers???=20
That is not that popular hypothesis. You typically use it as straw man.=20
Found remains show indications that our ancestors were still well
adapted to climbing trees, even after they had begun to walk upright.
> 4) had australopithecine ancestors??=20
And also its bones demonstrate features consistent with tree climbing.=20
> These are only anthropo- & afro-centric just-so pre-assumptions:=20
> - Darwin thought "Out of Africa" (Pan & Gorilla were African),=20
> - Africa (apart from sahara) is mostly jungle or savanna,=20
> - apiths lived in Africa, were BP, and had some humanlike anatomical trai=
ts.=20
>=20
Typical lie that all the science is what some bearded guys thought
more than hundred years ago. That kind of lies are common among
people who do not read scientific publications. IOW flat earthers,
geocentrists and deep one worshipers.
> Therefore, many (most?) PAs still assume, without evidence, that=20
> 1) we became BP after we split from Pan, and left the forest,=20
Where you concluded that we left forests? Why? Forest is full
of edible nuts, eggs, fruit, mushrooms and animals are easier to=20
trap or ambush. Is it because you live in country that has all=20
forest cut down? Do not mirror your tragedy to our ancestors.
> 2) Homo & "hominins" originated in Africa (OoA),=20
> 3) we ran bipedally in savannas,=20
Depends what savannas. Heavily wooded? Or why they had=20
capability to climb?=20
> 4) BP fossils in Africa incl. apiths are =E2=80=9Chominin=E2=80=9D (anthr=
opo-centric belief: Pan & Gorilla have no fossils=E2=80=A6??).=20
> But=20
> 1) early-Miocene Hominoidea were already BP=3Dvertical waders-climbers in=
swamp forests (humans & gibbons still are BP), google AQUARBOREAL,=20
Here is a word our sole deep one worshiper pushes. Note that
its sole evidence is few carved seashells found on Java. Place
where even crow can find seashells, but no one starts to tell
that crow did dive.
> 2) Mio-Pliocene Hominoidea came from N-Tethys coasts (hylobatids & pongid=
s still live in SE.Asia),=20
> 3) human ancestors have always been waterside (cf. physiology, anatomy, d=
iet+DHA, island colonizations, intercontin.dispersals etc.etc.),=20
> 4) E.Afr.apiths resemble Gorilla > Pan > Homo, S.Afr.apiths resemble Pan =
> Homo or Gorilla (e.g. my Hum.Evol.papers).=20
>=20
> https://www.gondwanatalks.com/l/the-waterside-hypothesis-wading-led-to-up=
right-walking-in-early-humans/=20
> Partial convergence? Nasalis monkeys (large & upright body, rel.long legs=
=E2=80=A6) in mangrove forests also often wade bipedally & climb arms overh=
ead.=20
>=20
> Likely scenario IMO: Plate Tectonics & Hominoid Splittings:=20
> c 30 Ma India approaching S-Asia formed island archipels =3D coastal fore=
sts++=20
> c 25 Ma Catarrhini reaching these islands became wading bipedally + climb=
ing arms overhead =3D aquarboreal Hominoidea.=20
> c 20 Ma India further underneath Asia split hylobatids (E) & other=3Dgrea=
t apes (W), both following coastal forests along N-Tethys Ocean (E vs W).=
=20
> c 15 Ma Mesopotamian Seaway Closure split pongid-sivapith (E) & hominid-d=
ryopith (W: Medit.Sea + hominids s.s. in incipient Red Sea swamp forests).=
=20
> c 8 Ma in Red Sea: N-Rift fm, followed by Gorilla -> Afar -> Praeanthropu=
s afarensis -> boisei -> today G.gorilla & G.beringei.=20
> c 5 Ma the Red Sea opens into Gulf (Francesca Mansfield thinks caused by =
the Zanclean mega-flood 5.33 Ma):=20
> =E2=80=93 Pan went right: E.Afr.coastal forests -> S-Rift -> Transvaal ->=
Australopith.africanus -> robustus (// Gorilla) -> today P.troglodytes & P=
.paniscus,=20
> =E2=80=93 Homo went left: S.Asian coasts -> Java early-Pleist.H.erectus -=
> shallow-diving: pachy-osteo-sclerosis, DHA, brain+, stone tools, shell en=
gravings...=20
> mid- -> late-Pleist.: diving -> wading -> walking H.sapiens.=20
>=20
> Early-Pleist. H.erectus' diet was probably mostly shellfish (engravings, =
stone tools, DHA & larger brain etc.),=20
> but what did Mio-Pliocene Hominoidea eat in coastal forests? fruits? mang=
rove oysters? sort of rice?? ...?
Yeah forests were more moist indeed before; stupid humans have dried
these out recently to gain access to wood with vehicles or for to turn thos=
e
into non-sustainable farmlands. Also there were floods sometimes so most
animals can swim fine, wolf, deer, bear, even PAN. But indeed ... go find
seashells in swamp. Good luck.
The savanna hypothesis did not become obsolete because your deep
divers found any ... counter-evidence is about climbing, not deep diving.
-- end of forwarded message --
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