MESSAGE
| DATE | 2016-11-16 |
| FROM | Rick Moen
|
| SUBJECT | Re: [Hangout-NYLXS] I'm sure it's a coincidence, part n+1
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Quoting Ruben Safir (mrbrklyn-at-panix.com):
> How many times were you beaten up by blacks in the hood Rick? Ever had
> your sister molested by a crowd of Black teens? Ever see a man shot is
> a race riot? Ever see crack addicts break your window when pan handling
> on Atlantic Avenue.
Please explain to me how fomenting a police riot of many thousands of
off-duty officers did anything constructive at all. If a candidate for
mayor near me did that, I'd want him immediately prosecuted and thrown
in prison, and I'd sure as hell never consider him qualified for even
dogcatcher, let alone Mayor.
I notice that you appear to have a fixation with using political power
to attack black people. Not surprising; so does Guiliani.
> Joel Berger can have all the free speech he wants, but NYC doesn't have
> to pay for it.
I'm _still_ not stupid, Ruben. To repeat, Guiliani's abuse of the
mayoral office did _not_ consist of his trying to cut off NYC funding of
Prof. Joel Berger, as there was _no_ NYC funding of Prof. Joel Berger.
Guiliani's aides called NYU on his behalf to threaten cutoff of city
funding for an unrelated program unless NYU fired Prof. Berger from
_its_ payroll.
Read that again and again, until you understand it -- because evidently
you are having severe reading-comprehension problems.
> You you failed to mention in your little diatribe against the Mayor is
> that those "racist" cops, or are you calling them pigs this week, they
> were no more or less racist then the black community which was
> plunging NYC into Dante's inferno and would hunt down and beat white
> people anywhere they could find them.
1. Do I have to teach you your NYC history, now? He wasn't the Mayor.
He was a candidate for Mayor.
2. I'm sorry, but are you seriously suggesting that inciting a police
riot is justified by some other people being racist? Or are you
back to imagining that I've suddenly become stupid?
> And you expect the police to be not racist in this situation, because
> you've never lived in a truly interracial community so your not aware
> what it is like when you have a low grade war going on throughout your
> childhood, or to be beat up for the crime of being White on Pitkin Avenue.
Actually, I expect an alleged leader like candidate Guiliani to not
deliberately incite the police to riot, which is clearly a premeditated
criminal act, and the very opposite of leadership.
> ...the Guilani miracle, and it was a fucking miracle, literally saved NYC.
Actually, we discussed this a couple of years ago on this mailing list.
Mayor Giuliani and Police Commissioner Bratton's escalation of
aggressive policing had nothing to do with the sharp decline in crime
rates, which started dropping years before the beginning of his
mayoralty, and was part of a broader trend also seen in Chicago, San
Diego, Miami and other cities.
And the root cause of that nationwide decline in crime rates starting
around 1990 was conclusively tracked down, as we discussed, by maverick
economics authors Steven Leavitt and Stephen Dubner. To refresh your
memory:
> The failure to enforce the Broken Windows Policy, which is
> completely different, came straight from the top....
The 'Broken Windows' metaphor is straight from the 1982 article of that
name by social scientists James Q. Wilson and George L. Kelling, leading
to a metric tonne of rhetoric including the metaphor's non-sequitur
invocation under your favourite mayor Mr. Guiliani starting 1993, to
justify (among other things) stop-and-frisk in various targeted parts of
NYC.
Lots of people including you claim City Hall's multifaceted Broken
Windows Policy that claimed to be following Wilson and Kelling's logic
(though often they were not) credited Mayor Guiliani with causing the
1990s' falloff in crime.
Guess what? That's provably _not_ what caused the 1990s falloff.
Conservative economist Steven Leavitt and journalist Stephen Dubner
proved through process of logical elimination that it was the
aftereffects of Roe v. Wade in the early 1970s. The young adults who
would have been the core of a continuing crime wave in the 1990s weren't
born at all starting in 1973 because of freer access to legal abortion.
This is heavily covered in Leavitt and Dubner's two books, but
adequately addressed here:
http://freakonomics.com/2005/05/15/abortion-and-crime-who-should-you-believe/
The two of them, FWIW, powerfully offended ideologues on both the left
and the right. Right-wingers were offended by the notion that various
strenuous law'n'order measures actually didn't work at all.
Left-wingers were offended by the notion that socially marginal people
often grow up to be criminals.
Making people angry is not the same as making a valid argument, but it's
somehow satisfying that Leavitt and Dubner, by making an airtight
scientific argument, managed to make enemies of two equal and opposite
camps of ideologues.
Anyway: Broken Windows Policy in NYC? Snake-oil as stated.
Pseudo-science.
You're welcome to dislike that fact. Go right ahead. You know you want
to.
> You should kiss his ass and drop in awe of a true hero.
Why was this true hero being paid, a couple of years ago, by a Marxist
Iranian terrorist group that helped murder American citizens in the 1970s and
launch an attack on U.S. soil in 1992 (NYC, see
http://www.nytimes.com/1992/04/06/world/iran-rebels-hit-missions-in-10-nations.html),
to advocate on its behalf when the State Department (correctly)
designated it as a terrorist group?
A Treasury Department investigation in 2012 found that Mujahideen-e
Khalq (MEK) had been funneling money to a list of U.S. politicians,
including Giuliani, in violation of laws against Americans receiving
money from designated terrorist organizations.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/josh-rogin/wp/2016/11/15/giuliani-was-paid-advocate-for-shady-iranian-dissident-group/
(John Bolton got some of that terrorist money, it appears. Well, well.)
Why did Giuliani's law firm White and Case do work while he was there
for Saddam Hussein, terrorist Abu Nidal, a Saudi bank linked to drug
cartels, and an Italian company that provided “expertise” for Gaddifi’s
chemical weapon program?
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2007/12/10/early-firm-work-ties-giul_n_76098.html
Why did Giuliani's law firm Bracewell & Giuliani do work while he was
there as a main partner for USA enemy Hugo Chávez's pet oil company
Citgo Petroleum?
Why did this true hero work as a consultant for a Serbian party
(Progressive Party) that condemns and opposes US involvement in the
Balkans?
http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052702304331204577356001702540714
Why does this true hero endorse use of torture by our armed forces?
https://thinkprogress.org/audience-applauds-as-giuliani-tancredo-endorse-waterboarding-torture-8754b99d8b41
> If Joel Berger wants free speech, let him get a magic marker....
Prof. Joel Berger _did_ have free speech. It's called the First
Amendment, and you might have heard of it even in whatever goddamned
banana republic _you're_ from. He wrote an op-ed for the _New York
Times_, and they published it. Done and done.
Mayor Rudy Punk-Ass Giuliani decided he didn't like what Prof. Berger
said, so, rather than doing the honorable thing of writing his own
damned editorial, he delegated to his aides -- because he doesn't even
do his own dirty work -- the shameful job of trying to pressure NY into
firing Prof. Berger.
This is of course chickenshit behavior, and shameful. It turns out that
this is classic Giuliani, a vindictive and petty little man who has no
scruples.
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