MESSAGE
| DATE | 2014-08-24 |
| FROM | Ruben Safir
|
| SUBJECT | Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] I'd be happy to pay of a GNU Desktop that works - College Bound
|
On 08/23/2014 01:58 PM, Chris Knadle wrote:
> Hey, Ruben.
>
> On Friday, August 22, 2014 11:37:34 Ruben Safir wrote:
>> right
>
> Heh. What are you referring to in the above? This thread is 4.5 /years/ old
> and after reading the full message I can't tell what you're trying to say
> about it now. ;-) Did you send this accidentally?
>
> -- Chris
>
> --
>
> Chris Knadle
> Chris.Knadle-at-coredump.us
>
No, what I am saying that the responses to go and program it yourself or
go use an ancient desktop are inappropriate. Furthermore, it isn't like
all the development is being done by unpaid professionals. Most of it
is done through sponsorships and paid work. The problem is that the
design just sucks from the ground up. The assumptions made about usage
and design are not for the convenience and security of the end user.
THEY ARE Mostly motivated by a commercial request or desire. This is
not necessary bad but the outcomes need to be monitored.
Currently, leading desktop and user interfaces all across the digital
world and failing the most basic standards of usability and digital
ownership. Sending something to facebook, that is one click or swipe.
Sending something to your home computer...that is NOT HAPPENING. This
is bad. The new devices and desktops are entirely too complicated,,
tied down and prevent access to your data. People can't wait to get
shit on the cloud because they can't move it around. They can't make
simple calls, transfer files, see their hard drive, download their music
and movie files, play links in their browsers, etc etc etc.
Interfaces are confusing as hell, and nobody knows wtf is going on as
long as they can get their candy crush...
Really, Candy Crush? Is that not a gnome-games from 1998 repackaged
into a 500 million dollar company?
BTW - I'm trying to go back to graduate School for Comp/Sci. I'm
Pharmacy burned out.
Actually, I have three choices.
A) LIU Comp/Sci program is 36 credits for an MS
B) City Tech CUNY has a heavy math intensive Applied
Mathmatics/Information Systems that includes:
MAT 2440
3
Discrete Structures and Algorithms I (recommended)
Program-Specific Degree Requirements
Total program-specific required and elective courses
78 credits
CST 2403 C++ Programming I 3
CST 3503 C++ Programming II 3
EET 1222 Circuit Analysis II 5
EET 1240 Electronics 4
EET 2140 Communications Electronics 3
EET 2162 Digital Electronics I 3
MAT 1475 3 Calculus I 4
MAT 1476L Calculus Laboratory 1
MAT 1575 Calculus II 4
MAT 2440 Discrete Structures and Algorithms I 3
MAT 2572 Probability and Mathematical Statistics I 4
MAT 2580 Introduction to Linear Algebra 3
MAT 2630 Applied Mathematics Technology ? 3
Numerical Methods
MAT 2675 Calculus III 4
MAT 3770 Mathematical Modeling I ? Optimization 3
MAT 4880 Mathematical Modeling II 3
MAT 4900 Internship I 2
MAT 4901 Internship II 2
PHYS 1441 General Physics I: Calculus Based 5
PHYS 1442 General Physics II: Calculus Based 5
TCET 2102 Analog and Digital Telephony 4
TCET 2242 Microcomputer Interfacing 3
TCET 3102 Analog and Digital Communications I 4
Electives (select as needed to add up to 78 4)
CST 2307 Networking Fundamentals 3
CST 3507 Advanced Single-LAN Concepts 3
MAT 2540 Discrete Structures and Algorithms II 3
MAT 2680 Differential Equations 3
MAT 3672 Probability and Mathematical Statistics II 4
MAT 3772 Stochastic Models 3
MAT 3777 Applied Mathematics ? 3
Applications of the Wave Equation
MAT 3787 Applied Mathematics ? Finite Fields 3
MAT 3788 Applied of the Heat Equation for 3
Financial Mathematics
MAT 3880 An Introduction to Partial Differential Equations 3
using Mathematical Methods in Biology
MAT 4672 Computational Statistics 3
MAT 4872 Probability and Mathematical Statistics III 4
This is intense and is all but starting school from scratch. I would
need access to student loans for 4 year worth of living....
Then there is the Comp/Sci City Tech Program:
Bachelor of Technology in
COMPUTER ENGINEERING TECHNOLOGY
CET 3510 Microcomputer Systems Technology 4
CET 3525 Electrical Networks 4
(Required only for students with AAS in EMT or MECH)
CET 3550
Analog and Digital Electronics
4
(Required only for students with AAS in MECH)
CET 3615 Instrumentation and Data Acquisition 4
CET 3625 Applied Analysis Laboratory 1
CET 3640 Software for Computer Control 3
CET 4705 Component and Subsystem Design I 2
CET 4711 Computer Controlled System Design I 2
CET 4762 Electromechanical Devices 4
(Required only of students with AAS in EET/TCET)
CET 4773 Inter-networking Technology 4
CET 4805 Component and Subsystem Design II 2
CET 4811 Computer Controlled System Design 2
CET 4864 Feedback Controlled Systems 4
Technical Elective I 5
(required only of students with an AAS in EMT or EET/CET)
or
Technical Elective II 6
or
Internship
or
CST 2403
Intro C++ Programming Language I
3MAT 2580 Introduction to Linear Algebra MAT 2680 Differential
Equations PHYS 1433 General Physics I: Algebra Based
The undergraduate programs actually look better except for the need to
remain in school for 3 years almost, and paying for it. The MS is
designed more for adults to do. 36 credits and your out.
Anyway, I need two letters of recommendation, and any input on loans or
scholarships will be much beloved.
Ruben
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 24, 2010 at 09:02:23PM -0500, Ruben Safir wrote:
>>> On Wed, Feb 24, 2010 at 12:48:08PM -0500, Chris Knadle wrote:
>>>> On Wednesday 24 February 2010 10:14:05 Devin Heitmueller wrote:
>>>>> On Tue, Feb 23, 2010 at 7:27 PM, Ruben Safir
> wrote:
>>>>>> There are so many problems with all the current desktops that I've
>>>>>> looked at. Umbuntu, OpenSUSE, Fedora, all of them. I sick of it.
>>>>>> It
>>>>>> feels like its taken a big step backward.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> First, porting everything from Kernal Space to desktop space just
>>>>>> sucks.
>>>>>> WHat used to work, no longer works. This goes from the cut and past
>>>>>> and
>>>>>> memory hogging of Firefox, the stupidity of Flash altogether, the
>>>>>> crap
>>>>>> that they foisted on the OS with Pulse Audio...it all just sucks
>>>>>
>>>>> This is a very painful thread to read.
>>>>>
>>>>> It's *really* hard to take technical criticism seriously from someone
>>>>> who has trouble figuring out how the "extern" keyword works.
>>>>
>>>> I think that's both disrespectful and disingenuous. C++ is only rarely
>>>> taught today in schools, and when it is, the "extern" keyword is not
>>>> discussed. In the book that was used in the first C++ class I took in
>>>> college, the "extern" keyword is only briefly mentioned on one page,
>>>> and only concerning external FUNCTIONS, not variables, and we never
>>>> used it. I would be /surprised/ if anyone that took a C++ class came
>>>> away with a good understanding of what the effects of using the
>>>> "extern" keyword actually did.
>>>
>>> That is exactly the reason I drilled down on it, because scope,
>>> namespace, global variables, extern, and static are all inadequately
>>> taught, or even written about in standard texts, and yet can me criticle
>>> to writing decent real world code. Another area that I want to flesh
>>> out in more detail is C Marco language, which I have never seen
>>> extensive documentation for, and let is the backbone to all the standard
>>> library hearder files. Just go look at the definitions of sizeof or
>>> size_t in stddef.h ..
>>>
>>> . */
>>>
>>> /*
>>>
>>> * ISO C Standard: 7.17 Common definitions
>>> */
>>>
>>> #if (!defined(_STDDEF_H) && !defined(_STDDEF_H_) &&
>>> !defined(_ANSI_STDDEF_H) \
>>>
>>> && !defined(__STDDEF_H__)) \
>>>
>>> || defined(__need_wchar_t) || defined(__need_size_t) \
>>> || defined(__need_ptrdiff_t) || defined(__need_NULL) \
>>> || defined(__need_wint_t)
>>>
>>> /* Any one of these symbols __need_* means that GNU libc
>>>
>>> wants us just to define one data type. So don't define
>>> the symbols that indicate this file's entire job has been done. */
>>>
>>> #if (!defined(__need_wchar_t) && !defined(__need_size_t) \
>>>
>>> && !defined(__need_ptrdiff_t) && !defined(__need_NULL) \
>>> && !defined(__need_wint_t))
>>>
>>> #define _STDDEF_H
>>> #define _STDDEF_H_
>>> /* snaroff-at-next.com says the NeXT needs this. */
>>> #define _ANSI_STDDEF_H
>>> /* Irix 5.1 needs this. */
>>> #define __STDDEF_H__
>>> #endif
>>>
>>> #include
>>> #endif
>>>
>>> /* In 4.3bsd-net2, machine/ansi.h defines these symbols, which are
>>>
>>> defined if the corresponding type is *not* defined.
>>> FreeBSD-2.1 defines _MACHINE_ANSI_H_ instead of _ANSI_H_ */
>>>
>>> #if defined(_ANSI_H_) || defined(_MACHINE_ANSI_H_)
>>> #if !defined(_SIZE_T_) && !defined(_BSD_SIZE_T_)
>>> #define _SIZE_T
>>> #endif
>>> #if !defined(_PTRDIFF_T_) && !defined(_BSD_PTRDIFF_T_)
>>> #define _PTRDIFF_T
>>> #endif
>>> /* On BSD/386 1.1, at least, machine/ansi.h defines _BSD_WCHAR_T_
>>>
>>> instead of _WCHAR_T_. */
>>>
>>> #if !defined(_WCHAR_T_) && !defined(_BSD_WCHAR_T_)
>>> #ifndef _BSD_WCHAR_T_
>>> #define _WCHAR_T
>>> #endif
>>> #endif
>>> /* Undef _FOO_T_ if we are supposed to define foo_t. */
>>> #if defined (__need_ptrdiff_t) || defined (_STDDEF_H_)
>>> #undef _PTRDIFF_T_
>>> #undef _BSD_PTRDIFF_T_
>>> #endif
>>> #if defined (__need_size_t) || defined (_STDDEF_H_)
>>> #undef _SIZE_T_
>>> #undef _BSD_SIZE_T_
>>> #endif
>>> #if defined (__need_wchar_t) || defined (_STDDEF_H_)
>>> #undef _WCHAR_T_
>>> #undef _BSD_WCHAR_T_
>>> #endif
>>> #endif /* defined(_ANSI_H_) || defined(_MACHINE_ANSI_H_) */
>>>
>>> /* Sequent's header files use _PTRDIFF_T_ in some conflicting way.
>>>
>>> Just ignore it. */
>>>
>>> #if defined (__sequent__) && defined (_PTRDIFF_T_)
>>> #undef _PTRDIFF_T_
>>> #endif
>>>
>>>
>>> and on and on....
>>>
>>> Ruben
>>>
>>>>> It feels like an eight year old sitting in the back seat of your car
>>>>> telling you how to drive better.
>>>>>
>>>>> Here's an idea: continue learning C/C++, become a real developer, and
>>>>> realize how hard this s**t actually is.
>>>>
>>>> Funny, because /that statement above/ sounds like an eight year old
>>>> sitting in the back seat of a car telling you to drive better. :-/
>>>>
>>>>> You don't like modern desktop distributions? Help improve them. Or
>>>>> downgrade to a copy of Slackware from 1999. Or acknowledge that the
>>>>> software that you paid zero dollars for doesn't work as well as you
>>>>> need it to and spend some money on a copy of Windows.
>>>>>
>>>>> Bitch bitch bitch. And here comes the whiny voice, "My Linux distro
>>>>> doesn't work do XYZ...." If you really care about Linux (which
>>>>> supposedly you do being Mr. Nylxs) then stop whining, roll up your
>>>>> sleeves, and submit some patches for the bugs that bother you the
>>>>> most.
>>>>
>>>> The problem with this idea is that "submitting patches" is a lot more
>>>> difficult than it sounds, because one first has to spend a lot of time
>>>> reading the code to try to understand it first. Reading someone else's
>>>> code IS HARDER than making code from scratch is. Then you have to
>>>> worry about whether the version you're using is older than the current
>>>> -dev version, how to use the relevant revision control systems the code
>>>> in question, how to generate a properly formatted diff, and WHO is the
>>>> correct person to send the patch to. [It might be the package
>>>> maintainer, might be the author, etc.]
>>>>
>>>> You've additionally made the assumption that Reuben hasn't sent bug
>>>> reports
>>>> and hasn't attempted to send a patch, rather than asking. I agree that
>>>> the
>>>> approach could have been better (more specifics, less ranting), but what
>>>> you've written here is worse, which boils down to "just shut up" and
>>>> pointing the finger. You have the capability of being a lot more
>>>> helpful than this.> >
>>>> -- Chris
>>>
>>> I did send bug reports witht he resultof usually getting messages like
>>> this pumped back at me...
>>>
>>> The problems I'm talking about is more than bugs, anyway. They are core
>>> design issues and when I have the Gnome Hackers Conference in Brooklyn a
>>> few years back I learned alot about how open they developers were to
>>> input that they don't agree with. The have largely driven Gnome off the
>>> deep end and are now in a pitch fork battle with the FSF over pure
>>> nonsense. We only invested about 5 thousand dollars to hold the
>>> conference.
>>>
>>>
>>> Ruben
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