MESSAGE
DATE | 2006-05-23 |
FROM | Ruben Safir
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SUBJECT | Subject: [rick@linuxmafia.com: Re: [Balug-talk] [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Its a sorry day for The Linux?Journal]
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----- Forwarded message from Rick Moen -----
Received: from frida.dreamhost.com (frida.dreamhost.com [66.33.206.23]) by www2.mrbrklyn.com (8.13.1/8.13.1/SuSE Linux 0.7) with ESMTP id k4N0gZ0i019755 for ; Mon, 22 May 2006 20:42:37 -0400 Received: from che.dreamhost.com (che.dreamhost.com [66.33.216.23]) by frida.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EFE4616D54E; Mon, 22 May 2006 17:42:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from che.dreamhost.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by che.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C17D1BB63; Mon, 22 May 2006 17:42:38 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: balug-talk-at-lists.balug.org Received: from linuxmafia.com (linuxmafia.com [198.144.195.186]) by che.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E29581BAC7 for ; Mon, 22 May 2006 17:42:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rick by linuxmafia.com with local (Exim 4.61 #1 (EximConfig 2.0)) id 1FiKyl-0001qT-V3 by authid for ; Mon, 22 May 2006 17:42:31 -0700 Date: Mon, 22 May 2006 17:42:31 -0700 From: Rick Moen To: balug-talk-at-lists.balug.org Message-ID: <20060523004231.GG29273-at-linuxmafia.com> References: <1148187208.6373.6.camel-at-stoneburner.xwredwing.net> <20060522171749.GS14850-at-linuxmafia.com> <1148320696.6373.16.camel-at-stoneburner.xwredwing.net> <20060522180506.GA29273-at-linuxmafia.com> <1148322214.6373.20.camel-at-stoneburner.xwredwing.net> <20060522184529.GB29273-at-linuxmafia.com> <1148325034.6373.37.camel-at-stoneburner.xwredwing.net> <20060522201343.GD29273-at-linuxmafia.com> <1148343751.6373.41.camel-at-stoneburner.xwredwing.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <1148343751.6373.41.camel-at-stoneburner.xwredwing.net> X-Mas: Bah humbug. User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.11+cvs20060403 X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: rick-at-linuxmafia.com Subject: Re: [Balug-talk] [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Its a sorry day for The Linux Journal X-BeenThere: balug-talk-at-lists.balug.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.6 Precedence: list List-Id: List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: balug-talk-bounces-at-lists.balug.org Errors-To: balug-talk-bounces-at-lists.balug.org Status: RO X-Status: X-Keywords: X-UID: 18353
Quoting Matt Thrailkill (matt-at-modestolan.com):
> I can't answer these questions. I don't personally morally object to > them. If I extrapolate the arguments I see other people make against > the use of any proprietary software, then those things cannot be > tolerated. That extremism isn't practical though, because you have a > hard time avoiding those things.
Actually, I was hoping to suggest that there are differences among BLOBS: Some are strictly OS-neutral initialisation code for hardware. That is not the case for, e.g., nVidia 3D video drivers or a whole slew of "fakeraid" software-RAID drivers that include key (and OS-specific functionality) inside them. Many of the latter are erroneously claimed to be "open source" merely because they include a thin wrapper of source code around a secret-sauce binary-only library core.
E.g., see the bottom of http://www.highpoint-tech.com/USA/bios_rr2320.htm . See that link for an "Open Source driver"? That's a baldfaced lie^W^W careless mistatement of fact. (I track these things at "Serial ATA" on http://linuxmafia.com/kb/Hardware/ .)
Of course, in an ideal world, we'd be able to stick to firmware ROMs of which we have full source code, too -- because what is provided as a hardware black-box capaibility need not necessarily remain so. (E.g., some of that stuff to initialise Prism II cards might usefully be done different or subject to adjustment, if we had source code.) But my point is that it doesn't raise the same _degree_ of concern as other binary-only software.
> I concede my point, you have convinced me that there is no serious > disconnect on morals vs. pragmatism and there aren't separate free > software and open source movements -- they are in fact the same thing, I > now see.
They're not the same thing -- but they aim towards the same end-result, and (despite well-poisoning claims to the contrary from some) proceed from the same desire for freedom on their part of their originators. (You can impugn the motives of some of the _adherents_, if you wish, but that's a different matter.)
_______________________________________________ balug-talk mailing list balug-talk-at-lists.balug.org http://lists.balug.org/listinfo.cgi/balug-talk-balug.org
----- End forwarded message -----
-- __________________________ Brooklyn Linux Solutions
So many immigrant groups have swept through our town that Brooklyn, like Atlantis, reaches mythological proportions in the mind of the world - RI Safir 1998
DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI Safir 2002 http://fairuse.nylxs.com
"Yeah - I write Free Software...so SUE ME"
http://www.mrbrklyn.com - Consulting http://www.inns.net <-- Happy Clients http://www.nylxs.com - Leadership Development in Free Software http://www2.mrbrklyn.com/resources - Unpublished Archive or stories and articles from around the net http://www2.mrbrklyn.com/downtown.html - See the New Downtown Brooklyn....
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