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DATE 2005-05-01

HANGOUT

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Key: Value:

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MESSAGE
DATE 2005-05-01
FROM Ruben Safir
SUBJECT Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Bitkeeper Contravery
April 28, 2005 Enterprise Unix Roundup: The Bitkeeper Controversy By
Amy Newman and Michael Hall

Main In Other News Recent Updates Tips of
the Trade

Michael Hall Amy Newman

A few weeks ago we made passing mention of what has since come to be
known as "the Bitkeeper Controversy." We knew there'd be more to say
about the matter at a later date, but we weren't sure when that would
be. As it turns out, we were just waiting for the right last word.

In a nutshell, Linux kernel development has depended in no small
part on a revision management system called Bitkeeper. "The Bitkeeper
Controversy" is another one of those baroque Linux stories that cause
casual observers to shake their heads and go back to wondering if
Longhorn will ship with a better version of Solitaire.

Bitkeeper was adopted after widespread complaints about how Linux
leader Linus Torvalds was keeping up with the patches sent to him;
its adoption prompted even more complaints because the software is not
Open Source or Free. As problematic as Bitkeeper's license was, however,
it solved a much bigger problem, which was the lack of a Free or Open
Source alternative that could come near Bitkeeper's capabilities. In a
case study moment of marketing insight, Bitkeeper's owner smoothed out
the license objections not by taking the product Open Source, but by
giving it away to Linux developers at no cost.

Longtime Linux observers might wonder how giving a proprietary product
away for no money would smooth over objections to the product's
proprietary nature. The answer to that question is fairly simple,
and it's part of the core conflict that forces us to use unwieldy
constructions like "the Free and Open Source software community"
or opaque acronyms like "FOSS." Part of that community (the "Free
Software" wing) has assigned a certain moral value to software; another
part of that community (the "Open Source" wing) downplays discussions
about software morality in favor of what it prefers to think of as
"pragmatism."

At the time Bitkeeper was selected, the self-styled pragmatists weren't
interested in worrying about the license behind a needed tool, and they
were even less interested in building an open source alternative. If
no suitable alternative is available, the reasoning went, we'll just
have to chalk it up to one of life's funny contradictions. And they
went back to coding.

All was as well as it could be under this arrangement, until recently,
when Bitkeeper's owner began to complain that certain Linux developers
were trying to reverse-engineer his product. After some unsuccessful
back and forth, the no-cost version of Bitkeeper was slated to be
pulled, and the Linux kernel team was left without a way to keep its
patches straight.

In the pragmatist version of this narrative, this is how the story ended:

Linus Torvalds announced he was working on his own patch tracking system,
called "git." It was picked up by the kernel developers who needed to
stay in sync with Linus, and the Linux kernel rumbled on.

Two weeks ago, that was where things stood, and it didn't stir us to
revisit the story. What got us to provide this recap was commentary from
Richard Stallman of the Free Software Foundation, who argued against
adopting Bitkeeper in 2002, and who has provided, more than anyone,
the most consistent voice in favor of considering the ethical dimensions
of software licensing:

The Free Software Movement has said 'Think of free speech, not free
beer' for 15 years. McVoy said the opposite; he invited developers
to focus on the lack of monetary price, instead of on freedom. A
free software activist would dismiss this suggestion, but those
in our community who value technical advantage above freedom and
community were susceptible to it.

[...]

It was also, whether intentionally or not, a powerful
political PR campaign, telling the free software community
that freedom-denying software is acceptable as long as
it's convenient. If we had taken that attitude towards
Unix in 1984, where would we be today? Nowhere. If we had
accepted using Unix, instead of setting out to replace it,
nothing like the GNU/Linux system would exist.

Free Software activists haven't been able to point to a
more straightforward object lesson since the legendary
closed-source printer driver, which inspired Stallman to
launch the movement in the first place.

If concerns about the dangers of lock-in and dependence on a
tool that's available only at whim aren't pragmatic, what is?

-- __________________________ Brooklyn Linux Solutions

So many immigrant groups have swept through our town that Brooklyn, like
Atlantis, reaches mythological proportions in the mind of the world -
RI Safir 1998

DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI Safir 2002
http://fairuse.nylxs.com

"Yeah - I write Free Software...so SUE ME"

http://www.mrbrklyn.com - Consulting http://www.inns.net <-- Happy
Clients http://www.nylxs.com - Leadership Development in Free Software
http://www2.mrbrklyn.com/resources - Unpublished Archive or stories and
articles from around the net http://www2.mrbrklyn.com/downtown.html -
See the New Downtown Brooklyn....

  1. 2005-05-01 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Fw: [wwwac] Monday 2 May 2005 NYC Committee on Technology in Government: Telecommunications Infrastructure and Economic Development
  2. 2005-05-01 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Fw: [wwwac] Monday 2 May 2005 NYC Committee on Technology in Government: Telecommunications Infrastructure and Economic Development
  3. 2005-05-01 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Bitkeeper Contravery
  4. 2005-05-01 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Linus announced new tool for version control
  5. 2005-05-01 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Fw: [wwwac] Monday 2 May 2005 NYC Committee on Technology in Government: Telecommunications Infrastructure and Economic Development
  6. 2005-05-02 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] DMCA Boarder War
  7. 2005-05-02 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Microsoft Reaches Out to Open-Source Community
  8. 2005-05-02 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Microsoft Reaches Out to Open-Source Community
  9. 2005-05-03 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] ssl for pop3
  10. 2005-05-03 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] ssl for pop3
  11. 2005-05-03 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] New Wireless phone
  12. 2005-05-04 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Old Hood is going digital subway
  13. 2005-05-04 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] virus security
  14. 2005-05-04 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] nylxs.com email addresses
  15. 2005-05-04 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] FW: LinuxWorld Summit NYC: Explore the possibilities. Register to
  16. 2005-05-04 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Fw: Personal Liberties in the Age of Terrorism, May 13 - Free for BC Students!
  17. 2005-05-04 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Last Months Board Meeting Minutes
  18. 2005-05-03 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Last Months Board Meeting Minutes
  19. 2005-05-03 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] City Is Backing Makeover for Decaying Brooklyn
  20. 2005-05-03 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Real Time Blackhole sites
  21. 2005-05-03 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Real Time Blackhole sites
  22. 2005-05-03 Matthew <mph-at-dorsai.org> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Real Time Blackhole sites
  23. 2005-05-03 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Real Time Blackhole sites
  24. 2005-05-03 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] HP AMD 64 bit Laptop for about $1000
  25. 2005-05-03 dspira-at-att.net (Dave_att) Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Fwd: idiots
  26. 2005-05-03 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Fwd: idiots
  27. 2005-05-03 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] City Is Backing Makeover for Decaying
  28. 2005-05-03 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] City Is Backing Makeover for Decaying Brooklyn
  29. 2005-05-03 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] City Is Backing Makeover for Decaying Brooklyn Waterfront
  30. 2005-05-03 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] More on the Free Linux Distro
  31. 2005-05-03 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Only Free Distro
  32. 2005-05-04 dspira-at-att.net (Dave_att) Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] FW: LinuxWorld Summit NYC: Explore the possibilities. Register to day.
  33. 2005-05-04 swd <sderrick-at-optonline.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Old Hood is going digital subway
  34. 2005-05-05 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] FW: LinuxWorld Summit NYC: Explore the
  35. 2005-05-05 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Ruth email me please
  36. 2005-05-05 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: New York Interop City - June 14th, 2005
  37. 2005-05-07 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] rant: Open Office "help"
  38. 2005-05-07 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] rant: Open Office "help"
  39. 2005-05-07 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] rant: Open Office "help"
  40. 2005-05-07 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] rant: Open Office "help"
  41. 2005-05-08 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Jobs
  42. 2005-05-08 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Spam to end all spam
  43. 2005-05-08 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Spam to end all spam
  44. 2005-05-08 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] FW: THIRTY LINES TO MAKE YOU SMILE]]
  45. 2005-05-08 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] CUPS is JUNK
  46. 2005-05-09 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] CUPS is JUNK
  47. 2005-05-09 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Board Meeting
  48. 2005-05-09 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] CUPS is JUNK
  49. 2005-05-09 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Vocational Training Bill Passes
  50. 2005-05-09 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] CUPS is JUNK
  51. 2005-05-09 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] CUPS is JUNK
  52. 2005-05-09 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] CUPS is JUNK
  53. 2005-05-11 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Opposing Views: The Debate Over The H-1B Visa Program
  54. 2005-05-11 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Opposing Views: The Debate Over The H-1B
  55. 2005-05-11 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Opposing Views: The Debate Over The H-1B Vi sa
  56. 2005-05-11 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Opposing Views: The Debate Over The H-1B Visa
  57. 2005-05-11 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Opposing Views: The Debate Over The H-1B Visa Program
  58. 2005-05-11 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Opposing Views: The Debate Over The H-1B Visa
  59. 2005-05-11 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Opposing Views: The Debate Over The H-1B Visa Program
  60. 2005-05-12 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [leekc-at-us.ibm.com: Invitation - NY June 21- IBM IT lifecycle management competitive briefing]
  61. 2005-05-12 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Opposing Views: The Debate Over The H-1B Visa Program
  62. 2005-05-12 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Novell loses another executive
  63. 2005-05-12 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Opposing Views: The Debate Over The H-1B Visa Program
  64. 2005-05-12 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] I leave this for your discussion ..
  65. 2005-05-12 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Novell loses another executive
  66. 2005-05-12 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Opposing Views: The Debate Over The H-1B
  67. 2005-05-12 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [hangout] Arafat Dead - and the beat goes on..
  68. 2005-05-12 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[NYLXS_-_HANGOUT]_Opposing_Views:_The_Debate?=
  69. 2005-05-12 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Moving off of SuSE
  70. 2005-05-12 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Null modem
  71. 2005-05-12 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Null modem
  72. 2005-05-12 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Null modem
  73. 2005-05-12 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Null modem
  74. 2005-05-12 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Moving off of SuSE
  75. 2005-05-12 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Moving off of SuSE
  76. 2005-05-12 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Null modem
  77. 2005-05-12 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Moving off of SuSE
  78. 2005-05-12 From: "Jared Martin" <jmartin-at-dglaw.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Moving off of SuSE
  79. 2005-05-12 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Moving off of SuSE
  80. 2005-05-12 Mark Andrews <Mark_Andrews-at-isc.org> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] I have been patient.
  81. 2005-05-13 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] IBM backs Firefox in-houseBy Martin LaMonica, CNET News.com
  82. 2005-05-13 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] IBM backs Firefox in-houseBy Martin LaMonica, CNET News.com
  83. 2005-05-13 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] bruce.lai-at-council.nyc.ny.us: Upcoming hearings by the Committee on Technology in Government of the New York City Council (as of 5.13.05).
  84. 2005-05-13 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Board Meeting Reminder
  85. 2005-05-13 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Taking a look back prior to 9-11
  86. 2005-05-14 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Real Time Blackhole sites
  87. 2005-05-14 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Hope this still works
  88. 2005-05-14 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Open Meeting: Freedom-IT Scholarship fund
  89. 2005-05-15 swd <sderrick-at-optonline.net> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Business
  90. 2005-05-15 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Membership and Fund Raising/ Bryant Park
  91. 2005-05-15 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Business
  92. 2005-05-15 swd <sderrick-at-optonline.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Business
  93. 2005-05-15 swd <sderrick-at-optonline.net> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] RE: Business - NOT SPAM!
  94. 2005-05-15 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Membership and Fund Raising/ Bryant Park
  95. 2005-05-15 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] RE: Business - NOT SPAM!
  96. 2005-05-16 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Membership and Fund Raising/ Bryant Park
  97. 2005-05-16 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Hyper-Threading Vulnerability
  98. 2005-05-16 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Nylxs website
  99. 2005-05-16 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Re: [info] NYLXS]
  100. 2005-05-16 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] RE: [hangout] Ruben, "Star Wars" tickets are on sale now on
  101. 2005-05-16 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] RE: [hangout] Ruben, "Star Wars" tickets are
  102. 2005-05-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Healthcare Information Technology
  103. 2005-05-17 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Star Wars
  104. 2005-05-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Star Wars
  105. 2005-05-17 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Star Wars
  106. 2005-05-16 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] RE: [hangout] Ruben, "Star Wars" tickets are
  107. 2005-05-16 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Re: [info] NYLXS]
  108. 2005-05-17 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Web sites: Linux Distribution Chooser
  109. 2005-05-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] the internet has become useless
  110. 2005-05-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Back to school
  111. 2005-05-17 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] SUSE 9.3 Disks
  112. 2005-05-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] SUSE 9.3 Disks
  113. 2005-05-17 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] SUSE 9.3 Disks
  114. 2005-05-17 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Back to school
  115. 2005-05-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Back to school
  116. 2005-05-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Back to school
  117. 2005-05-17 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] SUSE 9.3 Disks
  118. 2005-05-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] SUSE 9.3 Disks
  119. 2005-05-17 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] SUSE 9.3 Disks
  120. 2005-05-17 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] SUSE 9.3 Disks
  121. 2005-05-17 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] SUSE 9.3 Disks
  122. 2005-05-17 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Back to school
  123. 2005-05-17 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Back to school
  124. 2005-05-17 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Fw: Don't forget to take advantage of Novell's great offer on shopNovell
  125. 2005-05-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: Healthcare Information Technology
  126. 2005-05-17 Contrarian <adrba-at-nyct.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Back to school
  127. 2005-05-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Back to school
  128. 2005-05-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] FREEDOM-IT MEETING - Tomorrow
  129. 2005-05-17 From: "J.E. Cripps" <cycmn-at-nyct.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Back to school
  130. 2005-05-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Back to school
  131. 2005-05-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Brooklyn Centric News
  132. 2005-05-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] And while we are talking about Brooklyn College...
  133. 2005-05-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Free Pass to computer expo
  134. 2005-05-18 Contrarian <adrba-at-nyct.net> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] NYLXS Board Minutes May 11 2005
  135. 2005-05-18 Mark Simko <msimko-at-optonline.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] NYLXS Board Minutes May 11 2005
  136. 2005-05-18 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] NYLXS Board Minutes May 11 2005
  137. 2005-05-18 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] NYLXS Board Minutes May 11 2005
  138. 2005-05-18 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: Healthcare Information Technology
  139. 2005-05-18 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [nylug-talk] Dvorak's article on Linux Community
  140. 2005-05-19 Ruben Safir <mrbrklyn101-at-yahoo.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] fsfsffsfsd
  141. 2005-05-19 Ruben Safir <mrbrklyn101-at-yahoo.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] fsfsdfasdfsd
  142. 2005-05-19 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Fw: [Politics] Lost
  143. 2005-05-19 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Sendmail Relaying
  144. 2005-05-20 dspira-at-att.net (Dave_att) Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: FW: Returned mail: delivery problems encountered
  145. 2005-05-20 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Minutes of Grant proposal committee 5-17-05
  146. 2005-05-20 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Minutes of Grant proposal committee 5-17-05
  147. 2005-05-20 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Freedom-IT Report
  148. 2005-05-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Freedom-IT Report
  149. 2005-05-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Flu preparations
  150. 2005-05-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Transistor Engineering
  151. 2005-05-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Anyone ever hear of this company?
  152. 2005-05-23 Ruben Safir <mrbrklyn101-at-yahoo.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Star Wars Party
  153. 2005-05-23 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Student Interest in Computer Science Plummets
  154. 2005-05-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Student Interest in Computer Science Plummets
  155. 2005-05-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Student Interest in Computer Science Plummets
  156. 2005-05-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Student Interest in Computer Science Plummets
  157. 2005-05-23 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Token Booths Shut Down At Eight Stations In Manhattan, Brooklyn
  158. 2005-05-23 Ruben Safir <mrbrklyn101-at-yahoo.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] su security
  159. 2005-05-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: refreshing
  160. 2005-05-24 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Real Time Blackhole sites
  161. 2005-05-24 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: In case you could use someone
  162. 2005-05-24 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Anyone know who IBM is using to teach teachers about GNU Systems?
  163. 2005-05-24 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] For Billy
  164. 2005-05-24 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Star Wars Night Tomorrow
  165. 2005-05-24 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Google Job in NY
  166. 2005-05-25 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Suse and floppy disks
  167. 2005-05-25 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Fw: Re: [wwwac] Court rules that presence of encryption software may be viewed as evidence of criminal intent.
  168. 2005-05-25 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Netscape 8.0 Requires Internet Explorer
  169. 2005-05-25 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Suse and floppy disks
  170. 2005-05-25 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Suse and floppy disks
  171. 2005-05-25 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Netscape 8.0 Requires Internet Explorer
  172. 2005-05-26 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Fw: SpiderTools Linux Training Savings
  173. 2005-05-26 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Fw: [Politics] Monsanto's confidential research finds that GM foods mess up rats
  174. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  175. 2005-05-26 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Fw: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  176. 2005-05-26 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  177. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: Fw: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  178. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: Fw: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  179. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Star Wars triggers P2P network crackdown
  180. 2005-05-26 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  181. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Star Wars triggers P2P network crackdown
  182. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  183. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  184. 2005-05-26 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  185. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  186. 2005-05-26 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Treo 650
  187. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Copyright Myth and the BSA
  188. 2005-05-26 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  189. 2005-05-26 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Treo 650
  190. 2005-05-26 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  191. 2005-05-26 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  192. 2005-05-26 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  193. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  194. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  195. 2005-05-26 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  196. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  197. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  198. 2005-05-26 From: "Jared T. Martin" <jmartin-at-dglaw.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] How do I edit my subscription?
  199. 2005-05-26 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  200. 2005-05-26 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Treo 650
  201. 2005-05-26 Michael E George <meg7-at-nyu.edu> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Logo and motto
  202. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Logo and motto
  203. 2005-05-26 dspira-at-att.net (Dave_att) Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] NYLXS mission statement
  204. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] NYLXS mission statement
  205. 2005-05-26 dspira-at-att.net (Dave_att) Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Donation page on website.
  206. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Logo and motto
  207. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Donation page on website.
  208. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Prganizational Structure -
  209. 2005-05-26 dspira-at-att.net (Dave_att) Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Donation page on website.
  210. 2005-05-26 dspira-at-att.net (Dave_att) Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Logo and motto
  211. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Logo and motto
  212. 2005-05-26 From: "Derrick H. Lewis" <lewisdj-at-bc.edu> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Website
  213. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Website
  214. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] I think this was the constitution minus a slight change we had to
  215. 2005-05-27 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: In case you could use someone
  216. 2005-05-27 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  217. 2005-05-27 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Nokia's tablet
  218. 2005-05-27 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Nokia's tablet
  219. 2005-05-27 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [CFSG-forum] Fwd: [refurbishers] New York City Electronics
  220. 2005-05-27 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [CFSG-forum] Fwd: [refurbishers] New York City Electronics
  221. 2005-05-27 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [CFSG-forum] Fwd: [refurbishers] New York City Electronics
  222. 2005-05-27 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Fwd: Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [CFSG-forum] Fwd: [refurbishers]
  223. 2005-05-27 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [CFSG-forum] Fwd: [refurbishers] New
  224. 2005-05-27 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[NYLXS_-_HANGOUT]_Re:_[CFSG-forum]_Fwd:_[ref?=
  225. 2005-05-27 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] I want a big 1973 Buick LeSabre
  226. 2005-05-27 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [CFSG-forum] Fwd:
  227. 2005-05-27 Michael E George <meg7-at-nyu.edu> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT]Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [CFSG-forum]
  228. 2005-05-27 From: "rc" <ray-pub-at-rcn.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Nokia's tablet
  229. 2005-05-27 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Nokia's tablet
  230. 2005-05-27 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Nokia's tablet
  231. 2005-05-27 From: "rc" <ray-pub-at-rcn.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Nokia's tablet
  232. 2005-05-27 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Nokia's tablet
  233. 2005-05-27 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Nokia's tablet
  234. 2005-05-27 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Nokia's tablet
  235. 2005-05-28 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Nokia's tablet
  236. 2005-05-28 From: "rc" <ray-pub-at-rcn.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Nokia's tablet
  237. 2005-05-28 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: [Hardhats-members] Re: Welcome!] Healthcare software under
  238. 2005-05-28 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Nokia's tablet
  239. 2005-05-28 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Lccal News in Brooklyn
  240. 2005-05-28 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Sunday Server Maintence Agenda
  241. 2005-05-29 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Jobs
  242. 2005-05-29 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Sunday Server Maintence Agenda
  243. 2005-05-29 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Nokia's tablet
  244. 2005-05-29 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Sunday Server Maintence Agenda
  245. 2005-05-29 David Etengoff <edtechmdy-at-yahoo.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] please remove my E-mail
  246. 2005-05-29 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Sunday Server Maintence Agenda
  247. 2005-05-29 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Sunday Server Maintence Agenda
  248. 2005-05-29 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Sunday Server Maintence Agenda
  249. 2005-05-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Web Server Status
  250. 2005-05-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  251. 2005-05-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [Hardhats-members] Re: CPRS Connection Problem
  252. 2005-05-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Re: [Hardhats-members] == CPRS Demo ==]
  253. 2005-05-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Re: [Hardhats-members] Re: CPRS Connection Problem]
  254. 2005-05-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Re: [Hardhats-members] Re: CPRS Connection Problem]
  255. 2005-05-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Re: [Hardhats-members] Re: CPRS Connection Problem]
  256. 2005-05-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Re: [Hardhats-members] Re: CPRS Connection Problem]
  257. 2005-05-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Re: [Hardhats-members] Re: CPRS Connection Problem]
  258. 2005-05-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Re: [Hardhats-members] Re: CPRS Connection Problem]
  259. 2005-05-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Re: [Hardhats-members] Re: CPRS Connection Problem]
  260. 2005-05-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Re: [Hardhats-members] Re: CPRS Connection Problem]
  261. 2005-05-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Re: [Hardhats-members] Re: CPRS Connection Problem]
  262. 2005-05-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Re: [Hardhats-members] Re: CPRS Connection Problem]
  263. 2005-05-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Re: [Hardhats-members] Re: CPRS Connection Problem]
  264. 2005-05-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] RMS on software patents
  265. 2005-05-31 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Novell acquires Immunix to enhance SuSe Linux security
  266. 2005-05-31 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Nokia allows Linux Kernel to use their patents

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