MESSAGE
| DATE | 2003-08-13 |
| FROM | From: "Steve Milo"
|
| SUBJECT | Subject: [hangout] Fwd: [NMLUG] OT Law. (fwd)
|
My latest rebuttal. Comments?
Steve M
Begin forwarded message:
> From: Steve Milo
> Date: Wed Aug 13, 2003 17:12:15 America/Denver
> To: slavik914-at-rennlist.com
> Subject: Re: [NMLUG] OT Law. (fwd)
>
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> Date: Wed, 13 Aug 2003 15:11:30 -0400 (EDT)
> From: Steve Milo
> Reply-To: nmlug-at-nmlug.org
> To: James Hamilton
> Cc: nmlug-at-nmlug.org
> Subject: Re: [NMLUG] OT Law.
>
>
> This is a flawed argument because your condeming the public by implying
> that no one has anything better to do than circumventing copyright
> protection. Wether the products have any value is irrelevant and only
> an
> opinion and I was clear on that.
> Further, I own only one CD that I can think of that has copied music.
> It
> is a collection of various artists that was given to me by a friend.
> After listening to that CD I liked one of the artists and respect him
> enought that I went out and bought one of his published CD's.
> Otherwise I have personally chosen not to download music because
> *I have better things to do*. Also, currently it is illegal
> to circumvent digital copyright protection measures. So thinking of a
> way around 'it' is a federal crime. It is currently illegal to play
> DVD's
> on a machine that contains Linux because of DeCSS closed source policy.
> And the protection of the federal goverment that prohibits any
> circumvention of digital copyright. So even the open source
> alternatives
> are illegal because of this.
> What if this law was around twenty some odd years ago when IBM's BIOS
> was
> reverse engineered?
>
> One of the largest consumers of downloaded music were the people
> serving
> in the military. They almost became federal criminals nearly overnight
> when the DMCA was enacted.
> But yet the music they downloaded had given a sense of what they were
> fighting for. If laws similar to the DMCA were enacted in WW2, there
> would have been no nose art on the bombers or fighters. Mickey Mouse
> would not have been a code word in the trenches. Based on these
> examples
> it didnt take much to keep the soldiers motivated and inspired.
> I havent served in the military so I can only imagine how the littlest
> evidence of what I would miss from home would mean to me.
>
> The consumable goods analogies are painfully flawed and stem from the
> federal goverment vs Microsoft monopoly suit. The analogy back then
> was
> 'think of Microsoft as a one big supermarket and in this supermarket
> are
> all kinds of products'. Thats all fine and dandy
> but there is more than one supermarket in the real world. And those
> supermarkets usually play nice. Walmart doesnt try to stifle the
> distribution of goods to other supermarkets. They just undercut
> everyone
> else in price and carry more products than any one store. They find
> the
> quality point in the customers mind and aim right at it. They dont use
> federal measures to try to protect themselves. They play by the rules
> and
> they do it right. They dont steal and they dont pretend that they
> invented the idea of one store carrying multiple goods.
>
> If my neighbor comes over and asks for a cup of sugar I dont have to
> worry
> about infringing on a copyright of sugar. My neighbor doesnt have to
> worry about
> infringing on a copyright by using the word sugar to ask me.
> In fact neither my neighbor nor I have to worry about using the brand
> name 'Domino sugar' or 'Walmart brand sugar' to ask for sugar. Or
> cereal
> for that matter.
> The method for distribution of sugar or cereal does not require by
> federal
> law, nor is there any such law that protects the possiblity that I
> have to
> actually carry around a special ID card to be able to purchase any
> particular brand of sugar or cereal.
> I go to the store, I choose the cereal I want, I pay for it at the
> counter
> and it is mine to be consumed and share with who I see fit.
> To take this one step further, there are no cameras in my bathroom or
> my
> neighbors bathroom to detect if the cereal that I ate was borrowed or
> purchased.
> Not that that sort of technology doesnt exist and couldnt be
> implemented.
> Thankfully congress doesnt have the stomach to digest that kind of
> measure, but there are laws that resemble this.
> However the technology and law do exist which prohibit me from
> shoplifting (i.e. gaining unauthorized access) to the cereal).
> By the same token the technology and law does exist that prohibits
> me from gaining unauthorized access to so called intellectual property.
> That is, without a federaly enforced measure that requires it to be
> installed in my home.
>
> The first amendment:
> Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or
> prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of
> speech,
> or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and
> to
> petition the goverment for a redress of grievances.
>
> The fourth amendment:
> No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous
> crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a grand jury, except in
> cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the militia, when in
> actual service in time of war or public danger; nor shall any person be
> subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or
> limb;
> nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against
> himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without *due
> process of law*; nor shall private property be taken for public use,
> without just compensation.
>
> The Constitution states:
> To promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts, by securing for
> limited Times to Authors and Inventors the exclusive Right to their
> respective writings and discoveries.
>
> Any media distributor can establish a way to centrally control
> unauthorized access without me having to worry about being monitored
> in my
> own home.
>
> However this is what is being implemented with Microsofts Palladium
> and the 'fritz chip' that is being implemented in AMD's Opteron
> with Intel following closesly behind.
> Eavesdropping masquerading as security to protect companies and
> idustries
> that have trouble standing on its own merit.
> How long before any content on the internet is required that *every*
> computer require 'trusted computing platforms'. Otherwise be denied
> access to the internet all together. The NYU example of using
> vitalbooks
> is just the beginning, this is beyond eavesdropping this is putting a
> chokehold on the free exchange of information by the few who stand to
> gain
> financially from it.
> Earning money is not unconstitutional and I'm not against someone
> making a
> living. I am against someone making a living when it is detrimental
> to my
> personal growth and the laws enacted that are designed to enforce that
> stiflement.
>
> I am also within my Constitional right to voice my greviances on this
> matter. Which I will and I encourage others to do the same by letting
> your/our congressman know where the DMCA is flawed and detrimental.
>
> This is not a 'libertarian, democrat, republican' issue. This is a
> fundamental issue that concerns every American citizen from now till as
> long as such laws stay enacted. It isnt a matter of trusting the FCC
> or
> the FTC. It is a matter of every citizen taking the responsibility
> that
> is required of him or her to be aware and let these goverment
> institutions
> know when they make an important decision based on flawed evidence.
> It is not in our best interest to be lulled into a sense of
> complacency through the paranoia of someone who has a strangle hold on
> information.
> It is a matter of keeping the free exchange of information available
> for generation to come.
> And wether you want to believe it or not the DMCA is detrimental to
> national security. It is so very possible that any new discoveries
> in science can be limited to distribution on copyrighted DVD's to
> certain
> university students. Keeping the American people ignorant and passive
> through federaly enforced measures sets a poor example for the rest of
> the
> world.
> George Orwells 1984 is closer to reality now than some people might
> lead you to believe. This is technology the Soviet Union would have
> been
> afraid of.
>
> Steve M
>
> On Tue, 12 Aug 2003, James Hamilton wrote:
>
>> The consumer is telling the music and motion picture industry that
>> the offered
>> products don't fit their needs. Consumers bypass this by coming up
>> with
>> alternate unregulatable sources for distribution. It really doesn't
>> matter
>> what the copyright holders do or say people will continue to rip off
>> music
>> and video so long as it's in their best interest to do so. Why would
>> the
>> masses rip off music or video if it were offered at a reasonable
>> price in
>> a high quality format? I don't argue that the offered products have
>> no value
>> just that the cost far outweighs the benefit you get from purchasing.
>> We
>> generally refer to products like this as 'overpriced'. In most
>> situations the
>> market corrects itself, look at cereal prices before the 'no name
>> brands'
>> became a big deal in stores. There is no real argument here,
>> consumers have
>> spoken. Media distributors can choose to capitulate or they will be
>> replaced
>> with no name brand cereal, I mean replaced by consumer friendly media
>> distributors. The recording and motion picture industries do not
>> (even as a
>> combine unit) have the means necessary to force the issue in the way
>> they
>> are attempting to.
>>
>> On Tue, Aug 12, 2003 at 11:58:21AM -0700, wes robbins wrote:
>>> All I can say to this is the Last two CD's I got (21.99)(17.99). I
>>> got to my car listened to them. First song was so bad I skimmed the
>>> rest. The second CD had one new song and 14 version Of GO on it.
>>> And walked back in side to return it. Found out that If you open
>>> the CD your not aloud to return it.
>>>
>>> Those were the last two Cd's I have purchased.
>>>
>>> Don Wilde wrote:
>>>
>>>> Don, I don't trust any *SINGLE* media outlet tell me the truth about
>>>> anything. I like news aggregators like Google News
>>>> (http://news.google.com)
>>>> or Unknown News (http://www.unknownnews.net).
>>>>
>>> Agreed. One of my first projects once my regular PostUpPal is a
>>> working
>>> success is to add trust metrics to the content for my users.
>>> --
>>> Don Wilde ---------> Silver Lynx <----------
>>> Raising the Trajectory of Human Development
>>> ---------------------------------------------
>>> http://www.Silver-Lynx.com 001-505-891-4175
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NMLUG mailing list
>>> NMLUG-at-nmlug.org
>>> http://www.nmlug.org/mailman/listinfo/nmlug
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ---------------------------------
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>>> Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software
>> --
>>
>> James
>> _______________________________________________
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>>
>
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