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NYLXS Members have a lot to say and share but we don't keep many secrets. Join the Hangout Mailing List and say your peice.

DATE 2001-10-01

HANGOUT

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Key: Value:

Key: Value:

MESSAGE
DATE 2001-10-17
FROM Jay Sulzberger
SUBJECT Subject: [hangout] Re: [wwwac] Jakob Nielsen on how Apple blew it, how Linux will blow



---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Wed, 17 Oct 2001 11:50:50 -0500
From: R. Scott Granneman
To: Robert Gruber
Cc: wwwac-at-lists.wwwac.org
Subject: Re: [wwwac] Jakob Nielsen on how Apple blew it,
how Linux will blow it, and the Next Big Thing.

How has Apple blown it? I speak as a user of Linux & Windows 2K, not as
a Mac zealot. I saw OS X in CompUSA the other night, and it blew me
away. Besides, it's only been out now for what? 6 months? Jeez, give it
a chance! I don't understand why people are slamming it when it's still
new. I think it's the most exciting, wonderful thing that's happened to
the Mac in well over a decade.

As for Linux on the desktop ... well, I'm writing this from a Linux
machine running KDE. I use Linux as my main desktop 90%+ of the time.
And I just started running Linux as my desktop in March of this year.
Why? Because it's finally ready. I've been waiting since 1996 for a
version of Linux that I could use daily on my workstation. With the
release of Red Hat 7.0 and KDE 2, that waiting was over.

I do a LOT of public speaking and teaching out here in the conservative
midwest. Uniformly, people are very impressed with Linux on the desktop.
And I'm talking about businesspeople, teachers, students ... normal
people. They see Linux running on my laptop, I tell them about it, and
they're not scared. They're interested. Really, really interested.

In fact, I'm teaching a class this spring at one of the local community
colleges titled "Transitioning from Windows & Mac to Linux". Let me tell
you, it will fill up instantly. I know this for a fact. I've got far
more people interested in taking this class than can be accomodated.
Same thing for the summer session. In fact, I've already lined up a
second teacher for additional courses over the summer. I think it's
going to grow and grow and grow.

Microsoft has done, and is doing, a simply fabulous job ... driving
people to consider other options. As soon as I begin to tell people
about Product Activation, they are amazed, then scared, then angry. When
I talk about Windows crashes, they nod in agreement (and don't bother
talking about Win2K - they don't care. They've gotten burned badly, and
they're angry.). When I talk about Microsoft's increasingly ridiculous
licensing schemes to squeeze yet more money from people and
corporations, people get mad. And when I show people Linux and talk
about it, they see it as a viable alternative.

It's a wonderful synchronicity of events that Microsoft would overreach
itself in so many ways at the exact same time that the economy worsens
and at the same time that Linux gets to be really usable on the desktop.
The next several years are going to be very interesting.

Scott

Robert Gruber wrote:

> I'm sure Jacob Nielsen has some interesting things to say, but nothing
> I've ever seen or read of his, particularly the design of his own
> website, makes me think he's some sort of guru.
>
> He seems to think people are all neophytes who never learn and that we
> should always play to the lowest common denominator, even when that
> impedes the message or useability for more sophisticated users.
>
> Everyone on this list who subscribes to the non-digest version probably
> gets a coupla hundred emails a day. I'm sure most of us are quite
> productive, probably above any sort of productivity average if such a
> thing exists. Filters aren't such a advanced feature. If you get enough
> email to need filters, you probably know how to set them up or are
> extremely motivated to learn.
>
> I do think he is right about Apple blowing it though. It would have been
> nice to see OS X as a pardigm shift to something like piles or another
> way of associating and grouping documents. I think the hierarchtical
> system could use some improvement. Some sort of visual way of using Unix
> pipes would be cool too, so people could simply build the sort of
> applications or scripts they need visually. OS X is really a Unix core
> with a pretty face which is nice but not exactly revolutionary.
>
> There was an article in Web Techniques awhile back about how Linux
> should just stop focusing on the desktop and work on improving it's core
> features for servers. It argued that the desktop effort was a brain
> drain on Linux hackers whose efforts would be more profitably directed
> toward the server side. Basically instead of fighting an uphill battle
> against Microsoft on the desktop, they should be fighting the battle on
> the server side where they clearly have the edge.
>
> Rob


--

R. Scott Granneman
scott-at-granneman.com ~ www.granneman.com
Join GranneNotes! Information at www.granneman.com

"... any man's death diminishes me, because I am involved in mankind,
and therefore never send to know for whom the bell tolls; it tolls for
thee."
---John Donne



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____________________________
New Yorker Linux Users Scene
Fair Use -
because it's either fair use or useless....

  1. 2001-10-31 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Proposed Constitution TEMPLATE
  2. 2001-10-31 Joe Villari <joev_nylxs-at-pipeline.com> Subject: [hangout] Comments on Proposed Constitution
  3. 2001-10-31 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Total Registration
  4. 2001-10-31 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] 3 more registers for the perl course
  5. 2001-10-31 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] "Wes Boyd": War Profiteering
  6. 2001-10-31 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Proposed Constitution TEMPLATE
  7. 2001-10-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Fwd: [wwwac] How Linux saved Amazon millions [scott-at-granneman.com]
  8. 2001-10-30 From: "John F. Moore" <john-at-lions-wing.net> Subject: [hangout] "Wes Boyd": War Profiteering
  9. 2001-10-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Finances
  10. 2001-10-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] ANNOUNCEMENT - Special NYLXS Inservice Tech Lecture
  11. 2001-10-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Linux distribution for Toshiba Libretto
  12. 2001-10-30 joev_nylxs-at-pipeline.com Re:[hangout] Linux distribution for Toshiba Libretto
  13. 2001-10-29 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Congress is burning it's mail
  14. 2001-10-29 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Our new allies, Syrian, Sudan, and Libia
  15. 2001-10-29 Vadim Berezniker <vadim-at-berezniker.com> Re: [hangout] teaching perl: testing scripts
  16. 2001-10-29 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Brooklyn Tech Technology and Free Software (as in Linux)
  17. 2001-10-29 Vadim Berezniker <vadim-at-berezniker.com> Re: [hangout] teaching perl: testing scripts
  18. 2001-10-29 Abdele Darius Sabre <randombeeps-at-yahoo.com> RE: [hangout] Linux distribution for Toshiba Libretto
  19. 2001-10-29 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Installfeast Announcement
  20. 2001-10-29 Vadim Berezniker <vadim-at-berezniker.com> Re: [hangout] teaching perl: testing scripts
  21. 2001-10-29 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Linux distribution for Toshiba Libretto
  22. 2001-10-29 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [hangout] Linux distribution for Toshiba Libretto
  23. 2001-10-29 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [hangout] Linux distribution for Toshiba Libretto
  24. 2001-10-29 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [hangout] Linux distribution for Toshiba Libretto
  25. 2001-10-29 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] teaching perl: testing scripts
  26. 2001-10-29 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] teaching perl: testing scripts
  27. 2001-10-29 Brooklyn Linux Solutions CEO <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Linux distribution for Toshiba Libretto
  28. 2001-10-29 From: "Joseph A. Maffia" <jam-at-mail.rm-cpa.com> RE: [hangout] Linux distribution for Toshiba Libretto
  29. 2001-10-29 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Kernel Security alerts
  30. 2001-10-29 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] openssh - key based authentication
  31. 2001-10-29 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] openssh - key based authentication
  32. 2001-10-29 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Re: [wwwac] Linux says my 80GB drive is full, and it ain't
  33. 2001-10-29 Jay Sulzberger <jays-at-panix.com> Subject: [hangout] [wwwac] Linux says my 80GB drive is full, and it ain't (fwd)
  34. 2001-10-29 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] News Archieve
  35. 2001-10-29 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Responding to The Agenda
  36. 2001-10-29 Abdele Darius Sabre <randombeeps-at-yahoo.com> Re: [hangout] Proposed Constitution TEMPLATE
  37. 2001-10-27 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Proposed Constitution TEMPLATE
  38. 2001-10-27 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Interesting Site
  39. 2001-10-27 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Programmer Exposes Microsoft Digital Management Flaws
  40. 2001-10-26 Brooklyn Linux Solutions CEO <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Fair USe Canvassing
  41. 2001-10-26 David Sugar <dyfet-at-ostel.com> Re: [hangout] Statically linked Redhat
  42. 2001-10-26 David Sugar <dyfet-at-ostel.com> Re: [hangout] Statically linked Redhat
  43. 2001-10-26 Abdele Darius Sabre <randombeeps-at-yahoo.com> Re: [hangout] Statically linked Redhat
  44. 2001-10-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Statically linked Redhat
  45. 2001-10-26 Jay Sulzberger <jays-at-panix.com> Subject: [hangout] New York City Noon Monday 29 October 2001: Rally to Free Dmitry
  46. 2001-10-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Updating old Linux Counter accounts
  47. 2001-10-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Perl Course Announcement at NYLXS
  48. 2001-10-25 Ari Jort <arijort-at-valinux.com> Re: [hangout] Anti-Western and Extremist Views Pervade Saudi Schools
  49. 2001-10-24 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Charter Meeting
  50. 2001-10-24 Abdele Darius Sabre <randombeeps-at-yahoo.com> Re: [hangout] Responding to The Agenda
  51. 2001-10-24 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Responding to The Agenda
  52. 2001-10-24 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Re: Fw: November Tech Meetings
  53. 2001-10-24 From: "News" <news-at-impact-it.net> Subject: [hangout] Responding to The Agenda
  54. 2001-10-24 Ari Jort <arijort-at-valinux.com> Re: [hangout] Anti-Western and Extremist Views Pervade Saudi Schools
  55. 2001-10-24 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] NYLXS Starting Agenda
  56. 2001-10-24 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Anti_free Software
  57. 2001-10-24 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Fwd: [wwwac] Good Approach to a MySQL database [wwwac-at-focazio.com]
  58. 2001-10-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] FTC begged to ensure consmer rights
  59. 2001-10-23 Jay Sulzberger <jays-at-panix.com> Subject: [hangout] [wwwac] The Alley Responds--Silicon Alley Station live wedcast today
  60. 2001-10-23 Jeanne Edna Thelwell <thelwell-at-mindspring.com> Re: [hangout] Friendly words from our Muslim friends...
  61. 2001-10-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Friendly words from our Muslim friends...
  62. 2001-10-23 Brooklyn Linux Solutions CEO <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Friendly words from our Muslim friends...
  63. 2001-10-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Fwd: [wwwac] Volunteers needed for the Financial Technology Conference and Expo - 10/23-25 [scott-at-wwwac.org]
  64. 2001-10-22 Jay Sulzberger <jays-at-panix.com> Subject: [hangout] New York City Noon Monday 22 October 2001: Rally to Free Dmitry
  65. 2001-10-22 Brooklyn Linux Solutions CEO <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Linux 2.4 NAT HOWTO: Quick Translation From 2.0 and 2.2 Kernels
  66. 2001-10-20 Brooklyn Linux Solutions CEO <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Anti-Western and Extremist Views Pervade Saudi Schools
  67. 2001-10-19 Brooklyn Linux Solutions CEO <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] New York Linux Scene - First Meeting [ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com]
  68. 2001-10-19 Brooklyn Linux Solutions CEO <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] 2nd Important Announcement on Copyright and Fairuse
  69. 2001-10-19 Brooklyn Linux Solutions CEO <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Important Copyright/Fair Use Rally Announcment
  70. 2001-10-17 Brooklyn Linux Solutions CEO <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Bio Terrorism
  71. 2001-10-17 From: "J.E. Cripps" <cycmn-at-nyct.net> Re: [hangout] Bio Terrorism
  72. 2001-10-17 Brooklyn Linux Solutions CEO <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Re: [wwwac] Jakob Nielsen on how Apple blew it, how Linux will blow it, and the Next Big Thing. (fwd)
  73. 2001-10-17 Jay Sulzberger <jays-at-panix.com> Subject: [hangout] Re: [wwwac] Jakob Nielsen on how Apple blew it, how Linux will blow
  74. 2001-10-17 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [hangout] Time and Place of first meeting
  75. 2001-10-17 Brooklyn Linux Solutions CEO <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] web site content management
  76. 2001-10-16 Brooklyn Linux Solutions CEO <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Bio Terrorism
  77. 2001-10-16 Brooklyn Linux Solutions CEO <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Oct 23 - good meeting date
  78. 2001-10-16 Ruth Shanen <casandra-at-ix.netcom.com> Subject: [hangout] Oct 23 - good meeting date
  79. 2001-10-16 Brooklyn Linux Solutions CEO <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] [RHSA-2001:132-03] New util-linux packages available to fix /bin/login
  80. 2001-10-16 Brooklyn Linux Solutions CEO <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] RIAA Computer Warfare
  81. 2001-10-16 Brooklyn Linux Solutions CEO <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] attack on opensource, attack on economy?
  82. 2001-10-16 Matthew Hirsch <mph-at-dorsai.org> Subject: [hangout] attack on opensource, attack on economy?
  83. 2001-10-16 Brooklyn Linux Solutions CEO <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Setup of Free Swan - Authentication Troubles (fwd)
  84. 2001-10-15 Abdele Darius Sabre <randombeeps-at-yahoo.com> Subject: [hangout] Sent to me - I send to you
  85. 2001-10-15 David Sugar <dyfet-at-ostel.com> Re: [hangout] Time and Place of first meeting
  86. 2001-10-15 Brooklyn Linux Solutions CEO <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Re: [fairuse] Record Industry wants legal access to your computer
  87. 2001-10-15 Brooklyn Linux Solutions CEO <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Record Industry wants legal access to your computer
  88. 2001-10-15 Brooklyn Linux Solutions CEO <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Time and Place of first meeting
  89. 2001-10-15 David Sugar <dyfet-at-ostel.com> Re: [hangout] Time and Place of first meeting
  90. 2001-10-15 From: "Sean Auriti" <sean-at-ekaboo.com> Re: [hangout] Time and Place of first meeting
  91. 2001-10-15 David Sugar <dyfet-at-ostel.com> Re: [hangout] Time and Place of first meeting
  92. 2001-10-15 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [hangout] Time and Place of first meeting
  93. 2001-10-15 Brooklyn Linux Solutions CEO <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Time and Place of first meeting
  94. 2001-10-14 Jay Sulzberger <jays-at-panix.com> Subject: [hangout] New York City Noon Monday 15 October 2001: Rally to Free Dmitry
  95. 2001-10-13 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [hangout] Re: Computer Security Division Activities
  96. 2001-10-12 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [hangout] Peaceful demonstrations in Pakistan
  97. 2001-10-12 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [hangout] Peaceful demonstrations in Pakistan
  98. 2001-10-12 Brooklyn Linux Solutions CEO <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Peaceful demonstrations in Pakistan
  99. 2001-10-12 Jay Sulzberger <jays-at-panix.com> Subject: [hangout] Re: Install Feast in Brooklyn
  100. 2001-10-12 Brooklyn Linux Solutions CEO <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Time Flys Bye
  101. 2001-10-12 Brooklyn Linux Solutions CEO <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Install Feast in Brooklyn
  102. 2001-10-11 Ruth Shanen <casandra-at-ix.netcom.com> Re: [hangout] Time and Place of first meeting
  103. 2001-10-11 Ruth Shanen <casandra-at-ix.netcom.com> Re: [hangout] definition of TheLinuxSociety [ was:Organizational planning]
  104. 2001-10-11 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Subject: [hangout] Re: ON bot to go out
  105. 2001-10-11 Matthew Hirsch <mph-at-dorsai.org> Subject: [hangout] ON bot to go out
  106. 2001-10-11 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [hangout] Time and Place of first meeting
  107. 2001-10-11 Brooklyn Linux Solutions CEO <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] more PHP Copyright dribbl
  108. 2001-10-11 David Sugar <dyfet-at-ostel.com> Re: [hangout] more PHP Copyright dribbl
  109. 2001-10-11 Jon Bober <jwb235-at-nyu.edu> Re: [hangout] router/RCN issues
  110. 2001-10-11 Jon Bober <jwb235-at-nyu.edu> Re: [hangout] more PHP Copyright dribbl
  111. 2001-10-10 Brooklyn Linux Solutions CEO <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] more PHP Copyright dribbl
  112. 2001-10-10 Brooklyn Linux Solutions CEO <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Time and Place of first meeting
  113. 2001-10-10 Brooklyn Linux Solutions CEO <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Organizational planning
  114. 2001-10-08 Jay Sulzberger <jays-at-panix.com> Re: [hangout] Re: your mail
  115. 2001-10-08 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [hangout] Re: your mail
  116. 2001-10-08 Jay Sulzberger <jays-at-panix.com> Re: [hangout] Re: your mail
  117. 2001-10-08 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Subject: [hangout] Re: your mail
  118. 2001-10-08 Jay Sulzberger <jays-at-panix.com> Re: [hangout] billy's key redux.
  119. 2001-10-08 Jay Sulzberger <jays-at-panix.com> Re: [hangout] billy's key redux.
  120. 2001-10-07 Brooklyn Linux Solutions CEO <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Re: PHP Convention or the likee: PHP Convention or the like
  121. 2001-10-07 Brooklyn Linux Solutions CEO <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout]
  122. 2001-10-07 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net>
  123. 2001-10-07 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net>
  124. 2001-10-07 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [hangout] PGP - - - speaking of pgp
  125. 2001-10-07 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net>
  126. 2001-10-07 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net>
  127. 2001-10-07 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net>
  128. 2001-10-07 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net>

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